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NEW TEEN TITANS: GAMES ASHCAN (2001) Fanzine

cover:  George Perez
NEW TEEN TITANS: GAMES ASHCAN
Date:  2001
Cover Price:  $0.00
Publisher: Fanzine

Description
"Games" (80 pages)

Only 15 copies produced.

Cover scan from Marv Wolfman.



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    • Photos of George Perez from Megacon 2017 MEGACON 2017 (26 May 2017) Orlando, Florida Photos of George Perez from the Love is Love Charity Event at MEGACON 2017, in Orlando, Florida.  This is George Perez's only convention appearance in 2017, per doctor's orders since his heart attack (29 April 2017).  >>> eyenoise writes: 2017-05-27T01:31:06.000Z Heck yeah comic book legend George Perez! joshlovescinema writes: 2017-05-27T12:23:40.000Z Pics from the Love is Love event.  i was so happy to meet George Perez. He said "put your stuff down and let's take a proper picture" then he hugged me. Such a really nice guy. Then I got King to sign some Batman comics. It was a great event last ...
      Posted by Vu Nguyen
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    New Teen Titans: Games Ashcan Question

    posted Feb 3, 2016, 5:52 PM by Vu Nguyen [ updated Feb 3, 2016, 6:29 PM ]


    NEW TEEN TITANS: GAMES ASHCAN (2001)
    DC Comics
    Julian writes via Contact:
    2/3/2016 15:19:26


    I personally feel that the inking outside of Al Vey's, ruined the look of George Perez 's art on Games. It looked muddy , rough and messy. Al Vey or preferably George himself should have inked the entire book. I would like to see the scans of the ashcan book. How many do you have? Is there a Web page that has all 80 pages posted for viewing?

    Answer:
    According to the people who produced the book - only 15 were made... and the cover scan was courtesy of Marv Wolfman (so he probably own one of the copy).  If you aren't familiar, this Ashcan contain all 80 pages of George Perez's pencils that he originally produced in 1988 (with some pages inked by Al Vey).  In 2011, Marv Wolfman and George Perez (with the help of new inker Mike Perkins) finished and published the story in NEW TEEN TITANS: GAMES GN (Sep 2011).

    Update: the Erik pages were originally published online on January 2001.


    TEEN TITANS (Unpublished page from "Games")
    art by George Perez, colored by Tom Smith
    From Tom Smith
    Games (1)
    art by George Perez/Al Vey
    From Erik
    Games (2)
    art by George Perez/Al Vey
    From Erik
    Games (3)
    art by George Perez/Al Vey
    From Erik
    Games (4)
    art by George Perez/Al Vey
    From Erik
    Games (5)
    art by George Perez/Al Vey
    From Erik
    Games (6)
    art by George Perez/Al Vey
    From Erik
    Games (7)
    art by George Perez/Al Vey
    From Erik
    Games (8)
    art by George Perez/Al Vey
    From Erik
    Games (9)
    art by George Perez/Al Vey
    From Erik
    Games (10)
    art by George Perez/Al Vey
    From Erik
    Games (11)
    art by George Perez/Al Vey
    From Erik
    Games (12)
    art by George Perez/Al Vey
    From Erik


    News: Perez Art (August 7, 2006)

    Mon, 07 Aug 2006 00:00:15 CST [ submitted by Vu and Wattana Bo ]
     From www.comicartfans.com
    TEEN TITANS (Unpublished page from "Games") (1983)
    art by George Perez, colored by Tom Smith

    From Tom Smith

    JLA / AVENGERS (Unused color scheme) (2004), art by George Perez, colored by Tom Smith. Cover used for JLA/AVENGERS HC. From Tom Smith

    SCARLET WITCH (1979?), art by George Perez, colored by Wattana Bo (2006).
     January 29, 2004 | Wizard Magazine Covers "Games"
    From Vu


    NEW TEEN TITANS: GAMES (Sep 2011)
    DC Comics

    WIZARD: THE COMICS MAGAZINE #149 (Mar 2004), finally covered Marv Wolfman and George Pérez's TEEN TITANS: GAMES GN, which was, ironically, announced at WIZARD WORLD TEXAS (21-23 Nov 2003).

    George-Perez.com have been following the lead from Mark Metz (email), since October 26, 2003. Also note that the artwork used by Wizard (as well as other websites) was colored by Marcus Mebes.

    Read article:

    >>>

     November 30, 2003 | TT: Games Ashcan Cover
    From Vu


    NEW TEEN TITANS: GAMES ASHCAN (2001)
    Fanzine

    Marv Wolfman has a scan of the NEW TEEN TITANS: GAMES ASHCAN at this link: www.marvwolfman.com/NEW%20TEEN%20TITANS.html.

    The book was limited to 15 copies, for some fans and creators involved.

     March 14, 2003 | Wolfman: Titans Games
    From Marv Wolfman

    Subject: TITANS GAMES
    03/14/03 09:31:28 AM

    In opposite numbers:

    5: I NEVER said the current stories in Titans suck. First, I don't read the book and haven't since I got off it. That's just my policy. Since I haven't read it I obviously can't make any comment on it. Second, if I did read it and didn't like it I would still never say anything like that. It's not my style. The most I'd say (if I read it which I don't) is that it isn't my approach, but that's acceptable because I didn't follow the style of the writers who preceded me on the book and I wouldn't expect anyone to mimic what I did.
    #4: With a new editor in place who would let me do the Titans the right way, I would have cured Vic and Raven. Brought Joey back to life (I maintain that the Joey we saw after issue #50 wasn't the real one but a clone who came out of the Wildebeest clone stories). The Titans would have become friends again and the nastiness owould have been gone.
    #3: DC seems to have absolutely no interest in my doing any Titans stuff. All my pitches have been rejected.
    #2: In case the story ever does get published I think this should stay a secret.
    #1: I have high res scans of the original art but again, there seems to be no interest as I don't get any responses to any of my proposals to do this. Go figure.


    Replying to:

    Hi,
    I know you might really be tired of this questions on this topic, but here they are:
    1) Do you think DC would be interested in finishing the GAMES story and publishing it? Maybe have a penciller like Phil Jimenez finish the remaining 16 or so pages. As memory serves I think maybe 80 pages has been don already.
    2) You mention before one of the characters died? Who is it? Maybe the story could be an elseworld story or whatever, so we don't need to look into continuity... even though it's pretty screwed up already.
    3) I really enjoy your story in LEGENDS OF THE DC UNIVERSE #18 and the special #1, and even in the Titans #50. Do you think DC would make give you a couple of titans project in the future, or if you have any pitch for a Titans story, maybe an elseworld story picking up at a certain poin in titan continuity. Like maybe Jericho and Kole are going steady, Dick choosing to leave earth and be with his wife Kory, Deathstroke running for president,...etc etc.
    4) Given a chance, how would you continue writing the Teen Titans after the events of #130?
    5) I do agree with you that the current stories in the Titans suck!

    Erik

     February 16, 2003 | Wolfman's "What The--?" (Feb 16)
    From Silver Bullet Comics

    WHAT THE--?
    Still More Letters!
    Sunday, February 16
    written by Marv Wolfman

    (excerpt)

    From: kpierc72@e....

  • DC COMICS PRESENTS #26
  • How did the entire concept of the Teen Titans came about? Was it DC's intention for it to complete with the X-Men or was it a surprise hit? Had you and George Perez always had the idea of Cyborg, Raven and Starfire, back in Marvel? Why did DC not include firestorm within the Teen Titians. Who had come up with the concept of Nightwing.

    You’re not asking for much, are you? Seriously, I get this asked a lot and I may have even answered a version of this before here, but since folk don’t generally go through the back date archives, here we go again: Titans came up because I had decided to leave Marvel and move over to DC. Back then you could only work for one company, not both. Len (see above) was an editor at DC at the time and though I was given a number of assignments when I got there, I really wanted to do my own thing. Len and I had written a Titans story way back in the first series (the Russian Starfire (later Red Star) story and I always had a love for the Titans concept. I came up with a bunch of characters – more on this in a moment – then Len and I pitched it to the Powers That Be. Unfortunately, they didn’t want a new Titans series because they didn’t like the previous one. They had no thoughts about doing a DC version of X-Men, no matter what people think. Nor did I, by the way. Despite Len – who created the New X-Men being my editor – I was never much of an X-Men fan and doing a DC version of that book never crossed my mind. I wanted to do a ‘family’ book. Frankly, in my mind I wanted to do a DC version of the Fantastic Four, which, as Stan Lee himself has always admitted, was a Marvel version of the J.L.A.

    Anyway, the Powers That be asked us why they should publish a new Titans book when the last series didn’t do well, and we replied, with no false modesty, “Because we’ll do it better.” I guess they agreed because they not only greenlit the book but an introductory story that appeared in DC Presents #26. At this point I ran into George Perez up at Marvel and offered him the book. He said yes thinking it would be dead 6 issues later. 16 years later I got off the title and it’s still running today, with most of the characters intact, albeit in a somewhat different form.

    As for how the individual characters were created, that’s harder to say. I gave the group a lot of thought. I knew I’d want to use original Titans members Robin, Wonder Girl and Beast Boy (with a new name) in the new group. Kid Flash would probably appear but I wasn’t all that enthusiastic about him. My feeling has always been that writers have to pull back on that character because if you use him properly in a group book he’ll not only get to wherever they’re going faster than the other can, but he will probably have already solved the problem. In short, he’s too powerful for a group dynamic. I also didn’t want to make Aqualad a regular member because if you use him you are forced to use water stories to fit him in.

    I prepared a list of new characters. I wanted an alien, and that became Starfire. I wanted an athlete and that was Cyborg and finally I wanted an empath which became Raven. Obviously, it wasn’t as simple as that, but the work to create those characters, and to come up with a back-story I could keep mining whenever I wanted to, would take much too long to explain. Suffice it to say I spent a lot of time working out the characters so they would blend together both emotionally and power-wise before I gave the character descriptions to George to design. One he did I refined what I wrote and, as they say, the rest is history.

    To continue on how the Titans were created…

    ***
    From: David Peattie

  • NEW TEEN TITANS #28

  • NEW TEEN TITANS: GAMES ASHCAN (2001)
    Fanzine
    1.) I'd like to see a series of columns describing how you came up with the new characters you introduced in NEW TEEN TITANS. Starfire, Raven, Cyborg, and the ones who came later like Deathstroke, Terra, Kole, and so on. What prompted the idea for each character, what was involved in fleshing them out as characters, and what kind of response you initially got from DC about them all. Did the finished, published product closely match what you'd originally intended? If not, how much different did the end result come out to be? I know you said you didn't want to spend a lot of time on "behind the curtain" stuff, but I am always curious about how much of a writer's ideas make it to the printed page, and when something is rejected or altered, why the editor felt that was necessary.

    2.) In a similar vein, I remember that some years ago, you and George Perez were supposed to do a TITANS graphic novel that never did show up. Since the odds of it ever being finished and published are about the same as my chances of becoming Miss Universe, I wonder if you might clue us in on what the plot would have been?

    ...

    Okay, continuing from the above – I came up with Deathstroke pretty much right after I came up with the Titans. I knew Deathstroke would be in issue #2 but his son would appear in issue #1. The genesis of Deathstroke came very fast. I wanted a very moral character who was also a criminal, a sort of Batman for the mercenary world, complete with his own Alfred. Unlike Alfred, however, I wanted his partner to be his mentor. That’s where Wintergreen came from. His name, of course, came from the gum, just as Princess Koriand’r’s name came from the spice, coriander. She was the spicy Titan, after all. I wanted Slade Wilson to be the kind of character that you never could fully understand. You would also never know which side he would be on because he operated by his own very strict code of conduct. Slade would be troubled by what he had to do, but he was also caught up in a web of his own creation and was unable to break free. Simply, I wanted to create an antagonist who would be as well defined as the Titans themselves. Only mistake I think I made with him is having him have a physical relationship with the 16 year old Tara Markov. That was wrong.

    Which leads to Terra. That was easy. George and I wanted a Titan who betrayed the others. We also wanted to play against every reader conception of who characters are. George and I knew her whole story before we began and we knew she would die. We set the story up with her trying to destroy the Statue of Liberty to show she was the bad girl, but we knew if George drew her as a cute kid everyone would simply assume she would be ‘turned’ from the dark side because that’s the way it was always done which is why that wouldn’t be the way we did it. Tara was insane and stayed that way right until the moment she died. By the way, she IS dead. I don’t know what other writers will do with her – if anything – but if they want to honor the original series they will leave her dead. The Terra from Team Titans was – as stated – some kid the villain kidnapped and physically and mentally altered her into looking and acting like the original. But she was NEVER the real Terra.

    One last note: I came into DC with Terra the same day Mike Barr came into DC with Geo-Force. Both had earth-shifting powers. It would have been unfair for one of us to get rid of our character, so we decided to make them brother and sister.

    Finally, Kole. Because other editors were not pleased that they were asked to come up with characters to kill in the Crisis, I realized I’d have to come up with somebody to knock off as well, if only to assuage their feelings somewhat. I came up with the crystal powered Kole who was named after and drawn to look like a real person we knew. The problem was, Jose Luis Garcia Lopez, who drew the Kole issues did a magnificent job and I grew to really like the character and wished I hadn’t created her to die. But if I were to play the game nicely, she had to weave her last crystal.

    As for “Games,” the graphic novel George and I began way back when. George drew about 80 pages of the best Titans work he ever did before going into artist’s block on the Titans. I kept trying to convince DC to let another artist finish the last 30 pages, but for reasons that have never made sense to me they have always refused to do so. Every so often I bring it up again and the answer is still no. Why? I can’t imagine. There are 80 pages done. I’d have to dialogue the job and much of it would need to be inked, but I think even if it now had to be an Elseworlds book – or at least a Hypertime story – that people would flock to buy a hardcover Perez/Wolfman Titans book. What do you think?

     January 25, 2003 | Greenberger's Answer to "Games"
    From DC Boards
    Topic: Questions for Bob Greenberger
    posted January 24, 2003 09:19 AM
    posted by Bob Greenberger

    (excerpt)

    TITANS: GAMES was intended as a 96+ page graphic novel that George never finished. He partly never finished it because the story was never to everyone's satisfaction, if I recall. Once the project was shelved, many of the story elements were taken from the GN and used in the monthly. So, when the issue of finishing the book came up at some point, we realized how poorly it would compare with the stories done to date and it was decided by TPTB to keep it shelved.

     January 12, 2003 | WoW Cover (Apr 03)
    From NEW TEEN TITANS vol 3, #42 (Apr 88)
    TITANS TOWER (letter page)
    Apr 88

    NEWS! NEWS! Just today, Marv handed in his contract for a Titans graphic novel to be produced by Marv and George Pérez. It'll feature the Teen Titans and the Titans of Myth. This will take at least a year to produce, but it's definitely going to be worth waiting for!

     December 6, 2002 | Wolfman's Messageboard
    From Marv Wolfman
    Re: Thanks for the great stories, Marv!
    Date: 12/5/02 08:50:42 AM

    (excerpt)

    Thanks, Mike. I'd love to see DC print all George's an my Titans, and with a second Archives edition coming out soon, as well as the Titans Baxter reprinting, they are on the way to doing just that. I'd also love for them to finally finish and print the Titans graphic novel George and I started so many years ago. He completed about 80 pages of incredible art and we can always get someone else to finish it up and then have me write it as planned.


    Vu: Check out Marv's Bravenet Forum, Marv Wolfman and DC Indexes
     December 4, 2002 | TT: Trigon Update/TT Archives #2
    From ES, via Silver Bullet Comics
    The Terror of Trigon TPB
    posted 11-27-02 16:39 by ES

    Marv,
    DC just announced that The New Teen Titans Volume 2(1984) issues 1-5 will be collected into a Trade Parerback. Did you write a intro for the new TPB? I always like the introductions that provide a little behind the scenes info on the project. Just wondering.


    posted 12-04-02 04:31 by Marv Wolfman

    No, I was not asked to write an intro to the Trigon storyline. On the other hand, I did write the intro to the second Titans Archives edition. It is possible they asked George, which would make sense as it was, in many ways, his swan song on the Titans. He did do approximately 80 pages of a 120 page Titans graphic novel - that I think is still the best Titans work he ever did - but that has never seen print and to date there seems to be no interest in having me finish writing it and him - or someone else - finish drawing it. Even with another artist it would still be 80 pages of Perez/Wolfman Titans.

    As for the Trigon collection - I don't know too much about it. But I, too, hope it's printed as least as well as the original which was beautiful.

     October 7, 2002 | We've Got Letters (Oct 6)
    From Silver Bullet Comics
    Letters, We’ve Got Letters!
    Sunday, October 6
    By Marv Wolfman

    From: kpierc72@earthlink.net

    How did the entire concept of the Teen Titans came about? Was it DC's intention for it to complete with the X-Men or was it a surprise hit? Had you and George Perez always had the idea of Cyborg, Raven and Star fire, back in Marvel? Why did DC not include Firestorm within the Teen Titans. Who had come up with the concept of Nightwing?

  • DC COMICS PRESENTS #26
  • NEW TEEN TITANS #1
  • I will assume you’re asking about The New Teen Titans and not the original group. I don’t know who created that group – it could have been the editors or the writer, Bob Haney. Maybe someone out there knows? As for my group, I was leaving Marvel and coming over to DC (in those days you could only work for one company and not both) and was getting my assignments. My only request was no team-up books, so, naturally, I was assigned to DC Presents and Brave & Bold, both team-up books. Therefore, my first order of business was to get off those titles.

    Len Wein and I had written a story or two for the original Teen Titans way back in the late 60s, and I always had a warm spot for those characters, so I asked Len – who at this point had become an editor at DC – if we could revive the title. I went home and came up with the characters, so, no, there was not always a Starfire, Cyborg or Raven. You can read my introduction for the first Teen Titans Archives to see how they came about. Len and I went into publisher Jenette Kahn’s office and pitched my idea. Jenette said she did not like the previous version of the Titans and therefore wasn’t hot on the idea, but we said we’d do it better. Honestly, that’s all we said. Jenette, who trusted us, said fine.

    As I fleshed out the characters I ran into George Perez at the Marvel offices. I mentioned to him that I was working on a new version of the Titans and would he be interested in drawing it. George thought the book would last maybe a half dozen issues, and there was a chance he could also draw the Justice League, which was the book he really wanted to do, so he said yes. George then designed the look of each and every one of the characters.

    We showed Jenette what we had done and she liked it so much she decided we should do a 16 page original Titans story that they would put in free in DC Presents #26 to get people interest.

    [ Read more We've Got Letters (Oct 6) ]




     December 10, 2001 | Site Update
    From Andy Mangel's "PEREZ ARCHIVES"
    NEW TEEN TITANS: GAMES ASHCAN
    2001
    Publication is 80 pages, plus covers
    Self-published by a fan, printed by color photocopy.
    Features entire 71 pages of art for unpublished graphic novel, pencilled by Pérez, with first 30 pages inked by Pérez and Al Vey
    Also includes 8-page plot by Pérez, based on the mutal plot with Marv Wolfman.
    Limited to 15 copies for creative team and select audience only.
     November 24, 2001 | Titans Tower's "Games"
    From Vu
    Check out Titans Tower: Games for more details on the unpublished "Games" Titans Graphic Novel. As always be sure to check on Titans Tower for the latest in all things Titans.

    (excerpt)

    Juggling Schedules
    [from Comics Scene Magazine #11, 1990]

    Perez is now co-plotting The New Titans, plotting Wonder Woman and doing layouts for Action Comics. However, comics fandom hasn't seen the last of full Perez pencil art. He has a major work due out sometime in 1990: the long-awaited Titans graphic novel, Games.

    "I'm working on it right now. I'm trying to produce four pages a week so I'll be done by the end of January," Perez reports. "They're being inked by Karl Kesel and colored by John Stracuzzi. There's no firm release date. There have been so many that have come and gone that I want to play this a little closer to the vest. That's my fault, nobody else's. By producing on a four-pages-a-week schedule, I'm not forcing somebody else to do their part in a hurry. Karl's not going to get 120 pages to ink all at once: 'You have two weeks!' " he laughs.

     July 22, 2001 | Unpublished Titans "Games"
    From Cinescape
    Titans Lost and Genes Found
    Dateline: Saturday, July 21, 2001
    By: ARNOLD T. BLUMBERG

    (excerpt)

    "I didn’t know we were already referred to as legends," said Wolfman at a San Diego Comic-Con panel. "It’s like, we’re not around any more, but we’re remembered fondly."

    Their legendary status hasn’t slowed them down one bit. During the course of a one-on-one panel (a concept that left both creators a bit stymied as to how to proceed), Wein and Wolfman discussed their beginnings as teenagers breaking into the comic book business and the path that led them through both major publishers (at that time) and even into the frontiers of television animation. Wolfman also elaborated on the never completed TITANS graphic novel written by Wolfman and illustrated by George Perez, a project that – like many in the industry – faded into the background and still lingers in the minds of fans and creators alike.

    "George drew 80 pages of [an 120 page story] and hit an artist’s block," said Wolfman. "He literally could not draw another picture of the Titans. Having been in a writer’s block, I totally understand. He just hit a wall on it. I said, ‘Let’s get so and so to finish it up.’ For reasons that have escaped me for fifteen years, DC just decided to write it off. I would love to finish it. It was the best Titans story we had ever come up with."

    Although that project may be doomed to never see the light of day, for Wein and Wolfman, the future looks particularly bright. After decades of creating highly regarded comics, they have sold their very first feature film, and the convention attendees were some of the first to hear about their new take on superhero movies.

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